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 Copper shims
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Yetanother96
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
175 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2016 :  22:43:24 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Perhaps another problem for Melle to save the day.
Recently as part of my project, I decided to pull the cylinder heads on my 96V4. At the time I didn't notice the copper shims that in all fairness been spoken of many times.
However, by chance |I only noticed one of these shims when I cleaning up after removing the heads and even then it was already on the floor.
As I have read the read in couple of articles on the purpose of these shims, I understand the requirement for them. However I only can find one, so I assume that the other one has gone missing, despite my extensive search.
But as I didn't see exactly where they are fitted when I removed the heads, I would like to confirm where they are actually fitted, as I haven't actually seen any photographs.
Looking at the the pattern on the shim, I have guessed where it was fitted, I would therefore be grateful if someone could confirm this.
I have taken a couple of photographs to illustrate. Many thanks.

[URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/YetanotherSaab/media/DSCF2903_zps6fmo7qd0.jpg.html][/URL]

[URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/YetanotherSaab/media/DSCF2905_zpsy1gunt7a.jpg.html][/URL]

Yetanother96
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
175 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2016 :  22:51:40 Show Profile Reply with Quote
[URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/YetanotherSaab/media/Port_zpskntns7uq.jpg.html][/URL]
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Yetanother96
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
175 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2016 :  22:53:49 Show Profile Reply with Quote
I'm assuming there was two shims, I can't be positive as I can see the heads have been lifted before , as the bolt which doubles as the Earth connection for the battery was in the wrong place I think.

Edited by - Yetanother96 on 08 Jul 2016 23:14:46
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melle
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
2253 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2016 :  23:34:09 Show Profile Visit melle's Homepage Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Yetanother96
Perhaps another problem for Melle to save the day.
Yes I'm on duty today!

I hope when the previous owner refitted the heads the inlet manifold gasket was replaced? Or were they only taken off for inspection? I'd say reuse would be false economy as it would certainly lead to leaks. To be honest, I've never seen the copper tabs, which either means I've never come across an OE gasket or I've just never noticed them. None of the gaskets I've fitted (from eBay's finest to Reinz and the likes) had the tabs either. I see the point of fitting them, just never got round to doing so...

Hope to have my own gasket design laser cut and installed for testing soon, will include the tabs.

www.saabv4.com
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Yetanother96
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
175 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2016 :  09:18:16 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Hi Melle, from what I've read it would appear that these copper/brass shims are to prevent the gasket distorting and eventually bursting. This leads to localised overheating.http://www.saab-v4.co.uk/articles/headgasket/main.htm
The gasket set I have bought is from fleabay, but is advertised as being manufactured from the same material as OE gaskets. I'm quite happy to use them, though I will have to make another as I may have lost one. My problem is that as I didn't see them when I removed the heads, I'm not quite sure where they are fitted. The photograph I have fitted with the red line I've added shows where I think the shims go. I just need someone to confirm really. I am curious though why a hole is added though.
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melle
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
2253 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2016 :  12:26:46 Show Profile Visit melle's Homepage Reply with Quote
If you've bought the gaskets from Gaskets for Classics I can vouch for their quality: http://www.saab-v4.co.uk/speedball/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3668

www.saabv4.com
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pchristy
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1737 Posts

Posted - 12 Jul 2016 :  09:17:55 Show Profile Reply with Quote
When I replaced the inlet manifold on my V4 a few years ago, I made these shims up from thin brass sheet. Any good model shop should stock this - look for the K&S metal stand. From memory, I tacked them in place on the gasket with the tiniest drop of super-glue. This ensures they don't move during the fitting process.

I do remember reading somewhere about these shims and the importance of fitting them, and if I remember where I saw it, I'll post a link. It was some time ago, though, so don't hold your breath.....!

--
Pete
"Duct tape is like the Force: It has a light side and a dark side, and it binds the Universe together!"
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ianh
V4 Fanatic

United Kingdom
225 Posts

Posted - 12 Jul 2016 :  09:47:21 Show Profile Reply with Quote
http://www.saab-v4.co.uk/articles/headgasket/main.htm
Was it this one ?
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pchristy
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1737 Posts

Posted - 12 Jul 2016 :  14:42:18 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Well spotted that man! Yes, I'm sure that's it, although I thought it had pix as well. Perhaps my ageing memory is playing tricks on me....!

--
Pete
"Duct tape is like the Force: It has a light side and a dark side, and it binds the Universe together!"
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melle
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
2253 Posts

Posted - 17 Jul 2016 :  18:59:43 Show Profile Visit melle's Homepage Reply with Quote
An afterthought: if I remember correctly, the inlet gaskets form Gaskets for Classics, and also Reintz and Elring, are made from reinforced material, much like head gaskets. Would this omit the need for shims?

www.saabv4.com
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Yetanother96
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
175 Posts

Posted - 17 Jul 2016 :  23:14:49 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Following on from my earlier request for pictures and information as regards inlet manifold shims, as a point of interest I would like to draw your attention to the following. After pulling the engine from my 96 V4, I set about cleaning the engine bay and found a piece of gasket that had must have been dislodged as I initially cleaned the area. This was clearly from the inlet manifold covering the port the redundant port that has been written about elsewhere.
Although the picture doesn't show very clearly, where the gasket covers the port, the gasket has clearly bulged. No doubt in time this may have led to a failure. The purpose of the shim is to prevent this bulging. Although I am assured that I have purchased a good quality replacement gasket, I'm not taking any chances and I have fitted another shim anyway. There is a small hole which I believe is to allow in the manifold air pockets to be dispersed, I have lined up the holes and held the shim in position with blue Hylomar, though I wished I had used glue now. I may had a better photograph later on if I can.

[URL=http://s1360.photobucket.com/user/YetanotherSaab/media/b_zpspjndfcu0.jpg.html][/URL]
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