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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 01 Aug 2017 : 20:43:15
| Quick update, I couldn't find anything wrong with the oil after emptying it out, so I put it back in and started the engine. After about 5 seconds of idle, my (questionable) oil gauge showed around 12 PSI, up from the 5-8 PSI it had been showing before.
The air temp in my shop was around 89 Fahrenheit when I did that test. Thoughts? | Edited by - FromTheKeyboard on 01 Aug 2017 20:44:12 | |
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RhysN V4 Fanatic
United Kingdom 411 Posts | Posted - 01 Aug 2017 : 21:41:17
| I'm sorry, but emptying the oil to look at it won't show anything. Can you enlighten me as to why you think the gauge may be questionable? That type is usually reasonable. That pressure (10/12 )is better, but it's the running pressure that should be of most concern. That is when the motor will have load, idle is exactly that. The spec I gave a post or two back is what is suggested for these motors, not just a guess, and that's with a standard pump. | |
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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 01 Aug 2017 : 22:38:48
| quote: Originally posted by RhysN I'm sorry, but emptying the oil to look at it won't show anything. Can you enlighten me as to why you think the gauge may be questionable? That type is usually reasonable. That pressure (10/12 )is better, but it's the running pressure that should be of most concern. That is when the motor will have load, idle is exactly that. The spec I gave a post or two back is what is suggested for these motors, not just a guess, and that's with a standard pump.
I emptied the oil just to check for any metal particles that may have come from certain parts lacking oil. I do that when I'm unsure of the oil coverage/wear in a transmission as well. And I questioned the reliability of the gauge, because it had been on the car before I pulled it into my shop, and the car had been parked outside, untouched, for about 12 years. | |
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Derek V4 Guru
United Kingdom 2187 Posts | Posted - 02 Aug 2017 : 11:03:40
| Out of interest, if you pull the coil lead and crank it over from cold, how long does it take for the oil light go out? Is it about the same time as when hot? If you think your gauge is "questionable", best buy another that you can hopefully trust. Change to 20/50 oil. | |
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72sonett3 V4 Fanatic
Spain 269 Posts | Posted - 02 Aug 2017 : 16:33:02
| Oil pressure in a healthy V4 should be 3-4 bar (+/- 45-60 PSI). Most electric oil pressure sensors have both an analalog output for a gauge and a digital (on/off) output for a light.
My bet is that your low oil pressure is caused by worn balance shaft bearings. Another indicator is that you can feel any radial movement in the pulley.
-- '72 97 '77 96L conv. '79 96GL (LPG) '83 900i (LPG) '95 900SE conv. '99 9-3T | Edited by - 72sonett3 on 02 Aug 2017 16:56:07 | |
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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 02 Aug 2017 : 19:24:46
| quote: Originally posted by Derek Out of interest, if you pull the coil lead and crank it over from cold, how long does it take for the oil light go out? Is it about the same time as when hot? If you think your gauge is "questionable", best buy another that you can hopefully trust. Change to 20/50 oil.
I don't see 20/50 in my shop manual listed as one of the oils for the engine, but I'll hunt some up anyway.
Does it matter if it's synthetic? | Edited by - FromTheKeyboard on 02 Aug 2017 19:25:17 | |
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melle V4 Guru
United Kingdom 3830 Posts | Posted - 02 Aug 2017 : 20:05:08
| quote: Originally posted by FromTheKeyboard I don't see 20/50 in my shop manual listed as one of the oils for the engine
That's because the engine came from the factory without wear.
www.saabv4.com | |
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Derek V4 Guru
United Kingdom 2187 Posts | Posted - 02 Aug 2017 : 22:04:07
| quote: Originally posted by FromTheKeyboard
quote: Originally posted by Derek Out of interest, if you pull the coil lead and crank it over from cold, how long does it take for the oil light go out? Is it about the same time as when hot? If you think your gauge is "questionable", best buy another that you can hopefully trust. Change to 20/50 oil.
I don't see 20/50 in my shop manual listed as one of the oils for the engine, but I'll hunt some up anyway.
Does it matter if it's synthetic?
Synthetic is an unnecessary expense. Your profile doesn't say where you are. If we knew we might be able to suggest something suitable. Now days, zinc levels are down across the board so best to look for something with at least 1200ppm. Valvoline Fleet for example if you are in the USA.
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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 04:42:02
| [/quote] Synthetic is an unnecessary expense. Your profile doesn't say where you are. If we knew we might be able to suggest something suitable. Now days, zinc levels are down across the board so best to look for something with at least 1200ppm. Valvoline Fleet for example if you are in the USA. [/quote]
I see. I'm living in Washington State right now, I'll put "United States" on my profile later.
As for oil, I picked up some conventional Pennzoil 20/50 at my local NAPA, and swapped it for the 10/30 that was in there. At idle, the engine now peaks at 35 PSI, and nearly 50 at 2000 rpm.
I also checked the balance shaft pulley, and there is no noticeable wobble in-line with the shaft.
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RhysN V4 Fanatic
United Kingdom 411 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 08:45:32
| 35 psi at idle??????? That doesn't seem right to me. I would now be wondering about pressure relief valve. Where abouts in WA, I have some V4 friends who might be able to give a bit more help who live in various parts of the state. | |
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Derek V4 Guru
United Kingdom 2187 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 10:37:08
| 35psi at idle when cold is OK. 50psi when revved up when cold could be better but Fords have never been known for high psi. Don't know where the pressure is taken from on the V4 but the old Cortina engines used to have it on the camshaft I think, which didn't tell you what the big ends were getting for example. As your engine is out of the car, for peace of mind, it's not too onerous a task to pull the pan and check the oil pump properly. Put Washington State USA in your profile. There are plenty of UK members who are just as guilty and put nothing in their profiles either. Your county is fine if you don't want to be more specific but knowing it can be useful if someone else who is fairly local wants to offer help. | |
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72sonett3 V4 Fanatic
Spain 269 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 11:44:57
| quote: Don't know where the pressure is taken from on the V4 but the old Cortina engines used to have it on the camshaft I think
The oil pressure sensor (9) is at the end (front side) of the central oil gallery that supplies oil to all the bearings, see http://www.saab-v4.co.uk/speedball/topic.asp?topic_id=1228;
-- '72 97 '77 96L conv. '79 96GL (LPG) '83 900i (LPG) '95 900SE conv. '99 9-3T | Edited by - 72sonett3 on 03 Aug 2017 11:49:33 | |
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fuling Starting Member
Sweden 32 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 15:56:03
| Workshop Manual: Pressure relief valve opens 3.2-3.9bar. Now it does not say it's cold or hot engine. Or at what rpm. 3.2-3.9 bar gives an approximately what you should get as much as possible. | |
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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 18:12:02
| quote: Originally posted by Derek 35psi at idle when cold is OK. 50psi when revved up when cold could be better but Fords have never been known for high psi. Don't know where the pressure is taken from on the V4 but the old Cortina engines used to have it on the camshaft I think, which didn't tell you what the big ends were getting for example. As your engine is out of the car, for peace of mind, it's not too onerous a task to pull the pan and check the oil pump properly. Put Washington State USA in your profile. There are plenty of UK members who are just as guilty and put nothing in their profiles either. Your county is fine if you don't want to be more specific but knowing it can be useful if someone else who is fairly local wants to offer help.
I tried to put Washington State in the blank labeled "State", but it doesn't appear to be showing publicly. I do have the oil pan gasket sealed with Permagasket Aviation Form-a-gasket, but I've already removed a rocker cover gasket with the stuff on it once, so it shouldn't be too hard with the oil pan either. | |
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FromTheKeyboard Starting Member
USA 39 Posts | Posted - 03 Aug 2017 : 18:19:58
| quote: Originally posted by fuling Workshop Manual: Pressure relief valve opens 3.2-3.9bar. Now it does not say it's cold or hot engine. Or at what rpm. 3.2-3.9 bar gives an approximately what you should get as much as possible.
Well 3.2-3.9 is real close to the 45-50 PSI I was getting with the 20/50 oil at 2000 rpm (cold-ish).
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