SAAB V4 Forum
SAAB V4 Forum
Home | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Members | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 Technical
 General Technical
 Grinding Clutch - time for a new release bearing?
 New Topic  Reply to Topic 
 Printer Friendly 
Next Page
AuthorPrevious Topic Topic Next Topic
Page  of 2

EdinburghJoe
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
162 Posts

Posted - 12 Aug 2018 :  20:55:23 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Hi all,

I've spent more time driving my 96 ('73) than fixing it this summer, but I knew it couldn't last. After a 30 mile spell on the motorway yesterday the clutch started playing up - a grinding noise on operating the clutch, a sound that I could also 'feel' on the pedal. Only when I press the clutch, everything else seems normal.

Is it a good assumption that the release bearing needs replaced?

Now for the hard bit - I'd quite like to do this myself. I've done some work on the '96 so far (new fuel pump, stripped the front callipers, fixed an air leak, removed the radiator) but taking the engine out and working on the clutch is taking it to the next level for me!

I've got the Haynes manual and read through it and it seems OK in theory, but looking at posts on this forum it seems that clutches can get a bit complicated and I don't want to get out of my depth. I quite fancy having a go though - fixing them is part of the deal with these cars.

What's the general view on this? A fair thing for an amateur to do or one for the professionals?

If I do go for this my plan would be to change the bearing and probably the friction plate too. I've been having a poke around online and found the following - do they look right? (I assume my car has the original clutch setup)

Release bearing:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Clutch-Release-Bearing-for-SAAB-96-1-5-65-80-Ford-V4-Sachs-Genuine-Hatchback/311782392819?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Clutch Plate: (I took a punt on this and bought it as there was only one left...)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/253773636804

Do these look like good replacements for what I assume on my car is the original clutch setup?

I'll also need to get an engine hoist, and I think a tool to line the friction plate up. Would this sort of thing do the trick?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gearbox-Clutch-Removal-Alignment-Centering-Tool-Set-Car-Van/250769015509

Are there any other specialist tools I'll need? I have the usual suspects (including a torque wrench)

Thanks for any help,

Joe

72sonett3
V4 Fanatic

Spain
269 Posts

Posted - 12 Aug 2018 :  21:38:56 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Taking the engine out (leaving the gear box in the car) is a lot of work but not difficult. You just need to disconnect a lot of stuff.

There are several versions of the throw out/release bearing, this one looks OK.
The ebay link shows a Saab 9000 clutch, will not fit a V4. This is the complete set that you need;
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Clutch-Kit-3-part-for-SAAB-96-1-5-65-80-Ford-V4-Sachs-Genuine-Hatchback-Petrol/152846097371?fits=Car+Make%3ASaab%7CModel%3A96&epid=0&hash=item2396565bdb%3Ag%3AE40AAOSwjDZYi28J&_sacat=0&_nkw=saab+96+v4+clutch&_from=R40&rt=nc



To align the clutch plate with the pilot bearing you can use anything with the same diameter as the hole in the clutch plate hub, e.g copper water tubing.

Beware of the faulty F&S clutch plates where the friction ring is riveted to the gear box side of the hub instead of the flywheel side.

--
'72 97
'77 96L conv.
'79 96GL (LPG)
'83 900i (LPG)
'95 900SE conv.
'99 9-3T

Edited by - 72sonett3 on 12 Aug 2018 22:07:38
Go to Top of Page

EdinburghJoe
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
162 Posts

Posted - 12 Aug 2018 :  21:56:18 Show Profile Reply with Quote
You had me worried there! The eBay link points to an ended item (because I bought it). eBay in its wisdom tries to point you to something it thinks is similar (ie the clutch for a 9000) but if you click on the link in the text where it says ‘the Listing is no longer available ‘ then you should see the ‘real’ listing- it certainly claims to be for a 96!
Joe.
Go to Top of Page

72sonett3
V4 Fanatic

Spain
269 Posts

Posted - 12 Aug 2018 :  22:05:05 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Ah, yes, my mistake.
That clutch plate is OK, but it is the older style with 4 damper springs vs newer ones with 6 springs (but with the faulty batch). However, it is advised to replace the entire set of bearing + clutch plate + pressure group, and sometimes also the pilot bearing.

If you have the engine out you may find that the bearing arm has worn out holes in it that need welding. See other topics on this forum.

--
'72 97
'77 96L conv.
'79 96GL (LPG)
'83 900i (LPG)
'95 900SE conv.
'99 9-3T

Edited by - 72sonett3 on 13 Aug 2018 18:13:05
Go to Top of Page

Iain G
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
159 Posts

Posted - 13 Aug 2018 :  13:37:11 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Definitely agree with all 72Sonett3 said but also definitely worth checking clutch adjustment. Release fork might be going too far in when pedal pressed and corner of fork catching/grinding on the clutch cover plate.
Pull back rubber boot on slave cylinder and check free movement on hinge/actuator rod. Should have 5mm (can't remember exact measurement in the book but its difficult to measure exactly anyway). The key point is the release bearing must not be in contact with the pressure plate and there should be clearance. You can increase/decrease the free movement with the square-headed adjustment screw with lock-nut in the bell-housing. Sometimes the slave cylinder is shimmed forwards too where it attaches to the gearbox. You need to find an adjusted position where you get a good/reasonable clutch feel and no grinding.
Might keep you motoring for the rest of the summer and beyond.

Iain G
Go to Top of Page

72sonett3
V4 Fanatic

Spain
269 Posts

Posted - 13 Aug 2018 :  14:17:51 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Free play 'A' = 4 mm;



Adjustment screw 1, lock nut 2;



--
'72 97
'77 96L conv.
'79 96GL (LPG)
'83 900i (LPG)
'95 900SE conv.
'99 9-3T
Go to Top of Page

Iain G
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
159 Posts

Posted - 13 Aug 2018 :  14:47:13 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Nice work Kimosabe!

Iain G
Go to Top of Page

andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1994 Posts

Posted - 13 Aug 2018 :  18:03:44 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Joe
If you want a hand to get your engine out, and hopefully get it back in again, let me know.
I'd happily come across from Fife, and give you a hand.
ps We met briefly at the Bridge of Allan show last year.

Andy

1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro

Edited by - andydeans3 on 13 Aug 2018 18:04:36
Go to Top of Page

EdinburghJoe
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
162 Posts

Posted - 13 Aug 2018 :  21:38:36 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Thanks all,

Iain G - I did check the clutch adjustment as you described (and as per Haynes) and it was all OK, so unfortunately I don't get off the hook! The grinding noise sounds evenly throughout the clutch pedal travel (except for the little bit at the top before it starts to activate).

But the main message I'm getting is that taking the engine out and replacing the bearing is not something to be too put off by, and I'll assess the rest of the clutch while I'm in there and replace the friction plate. The car is relatively low mileage (I don't trust the clock, but I'd guess less than 50K) so I hope I don't find serious wear elsewhere.

Andy - thanks very much for your kind offer - I do remember you from the Bridge of Allan - I'll send you a PM.

Joe
Go to Top of Page

andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1994 Posts

Posted - 14 Aug 2018 :  09:48:07 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Joe.
PM doesn't work on this forum. (At least, whenever I've tried to use it, I always get an E mail telling me that it is undeliverable)

My E mail address is andydeans3, then the UK version of Yahoo.

Andy

1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro

Edited by - andydeans3 on 14 Aug 2018 09:50:22
Go to Top of Page

pchristy
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1790 Posts

Posted - 16 Aug 2018 :  09:36:18 Show Profile Reply with Quote
The very first major job I did on a car was changing the clutch on my V4, back in the early 70s! Prior to that, I'd only done routine maintenance. Its not difficult - I managed it with no previous experience - but there's quite a lot of heavy lifting involved and a lot of things to disconnect.

You need to remove the entire radiator / grill assembly, then unbolt the engine mounts from the floor pan and lift the engine slightly. This will enable you to get at and remove the starter. You have to do this to split the engine and gearbox.

Make sure the engine is well supported when you do this! You will have your hands and arms under the engine, and if it drops.....!

After that, its just a case of undoing a lot of bolts (and remembering where they came from!). When you lift the engine to slide it off the gearbox, put some wooden chocks under the 'box. Otherwise, when you pull the engine off, the 'box will drop onto the floorpan! Chocking up the box also makes it easier when you come to put the engine back!

Watch out for the clearance between the distributor and the cross-strut! Its probably worth removing at least the distributor cap (if not the whole distributor) to avoid accidental damage.

It a few years since I last had my engine out, but I think that's all the "gotchas" to look out for.

Best of luck!


--
Pete
"Duct tape is like the Force: It has a light side and a dark side, and it binds the Universe together!"
Go to Top of Page

Betsy67
V4 Fanatic

United Kingdom
409 Posts

Posted - 16 Aug 2018 :  09:57:10 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Is the noise a grinding or a chattering?
As mentioned it could be the release arm catching rather than the bearing being seized. No amount of adjustment on the push rod will rectify if it’s the clutch fork catching. Had this problem on Betsy which was solved with shims between the flywheel and pressure plate. Unfortunately it’s still an engine out job. There may still be some pics on my post in projects of what the pressure plate should look like.
Go to Top of Page

EdinburghJoe
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
162 Posts

Posted - 16 Aug 2018 :  21:31:36 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Thanks for all the advice Pete - I've been in contact with Andy and taken him up on his offer of help, and in the meantime I've made some progress, getting as far as I can before he comes over.

For Betsy's question, I'd say it's a regular grinding noise. If it is the release arm catching then with a bit of luck Andy will spot that and we can deal with it then.

Joe
Go to Top of Page

stevebod
V4 Fanatic

United Kingdom
416 Posts

Posted - 22 Aug 2018 :  11:27:13 Show Profile Reply with Quote
If it turns out that you need shims between the clutch and flyweel, then I managed this with the engine in situe.
I worked through the inspection hole on the bell housing. Through here you can loosen all 6 clutch bolts then remove them one at a time with a magnetic pick up stick inplace so you don't loose one. Then insert shim wahser (also with a magnet) and then replce bolt. It's a fiddle and if you drop anything you're scuppered, but it worked for me and was quicker than removing the engine.
Steve.
Go to Top of Page

EdinburghJoe
V4 Fan

United Kingdom
162 Posts

Posted - 22 Aug 2018 :  17:12:13 Show Profile Reply with Quote
That's impressive - are you a surgeon in your spare time?
PS - Last year I used your guide on adjusting the valve clearances - very helpful. I've also printed your clutch change guide to help with this work - thanks for taking the time to put all that stuff online.
Go to Top of Page

72sonett3
V4 Fanatic

Spain
269 Posts

Posted - 22 Aug 2018 :  20:04:56 Show Profile Reply with Quote
I saw stevebod's guide at http://steves-workshop.co.uk/vehicles/saab96/clutch/clutch.htm and although it is a small and unsharp pic, I think I see one of the faulty clutch plates

where the friction ring is riveted to the gear box side of the hub instead of to the flywheel side. :-(

--
'72 97
'77 96L conv.
'79 96GL (LPG)
'83 900i (LPG)
'95 900SE conv.
'99 9-3T
Go to Top of Page
Page  of 2Previous Topic Topic Next Topic 
Next Page
 New Topic  Reply to Topic 
 Printer Friendly 
Jump To: 
Snitz Forums 2000
SAAB V4 Forum© 2000-04 Snitz CommunicationsGo To Top Of Page