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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 18 Nov 2018 :  14:12:41 Show Profile Reply with Quote
I've stripped down my spare gearbox to rebuild it, and I've read lots of old posts on here and a few elsewhere.
This gearbox has done about 100000 miles, when it was in my car it was noisy in third and getting noisy in fourth, the change and freewheel were working well, the oil when I stripped it was clear and golden, and a bit stinky. No nasty swarf on the drain plug. It comes from a 1972/73 car, so has the oil catcher, 10 roller freewheel, nylon speedo drive.

The pinion shaft nut was totally slack and the primary shaft nut was only finger tight. The only serious wear I can find relates to the pinion shaft moving up and down because the rear bearing is worn.

I need to replace all the bearings, anyone bought these recently?
Gaskets and seals from Malbrad.
Presume the woodruff key is standard?
Are the speedo drive and spacer available anywhere?
Does anyone have experience of the improved tab washers and nuts for pinion and primary shafts?
Has anyone found suitable alternatives to the shim that sits between 3rd gear and the bearing?

Can you spot anything else in the photos? the sun gear shown is borderline, a little pitting starting to show.

Thanks in advance.
Jeff






andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1134 Posts

Posted - 18 Nov 2018 :  19:58:09 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Jeff

I believe most of the bearings are available as new parts, apart from the Pinion bearing part number 240426. It is no longer made, and though one or two turn up occasionally.

If you type 240426 into the search function on this forum, you'll find various threads about this bearing.

Below is a list of all the bearings.



1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro
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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 21 Nov 2018 :  18:11:29 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Thanks Andy

I've had a search about for bearings, looks like the only option for the rear pinion is one with a one piece inner track.

Thinking about it, I don't think it's such a bad idea, at least any wear won't leave the nut slack and the whole shaft moving up and down.


Cheers Jeff
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andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1134 Posts

Posted - 21 Nov 2018 :  18:56:52 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Geoff
I think you might be referring to bearing number 3305.
From what I've managed to glean from a "96 Gear Box" guru, near where I live, that was the bearing fitted when the car had the 2 stroke engine.
It was apparently changed to the 240426 bearing, when the V4 engine started to be fitted. ie the 3305 bearing is not up to the extra power that comes from a V4 engine, versus the 2 stroke.
Having said that, since the 240426 bearing seems to be harder to find, new, as hen's teeth, you could give the 3305 bearing a go.

Andy

1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro
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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 21 Nov 2018 :  19:12:58 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Andy
Yes that was my plan, 3305NR has the snap ring.

I think the change to the 2 piece centre was a bit of an error on SAABs part. Because of the gap between the two halves the nut will never stay tight.


Jeff
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andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1134 Posts

Posted - 21 Nov 2018 :  21:06:41 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Geoff
You could try this outfit in France, who seem to list the 240426 bearing. SKF bearing 98.90 euros.
If you type 240426 in the search box, you'll find it.

https://www.123roulement.com/rubrique-general.php

If you contact this outfit, and buy one, and it is the correct one, let us all know!

Andy

1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro

Edited by - andydeans3 on 22 Nov 2018 12:44:12
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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 22 Nov 2018 :  19:35:31 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Andy

Like others who have been on this path before me I don't fancy putting 98 euros down blind.

I've asked for photos, again. Maybe they will get bored and send some if enough of us ask.


Cheers Jeff
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andydeans3
V4 Guru

United Kingdom
1134 Posts

Posted - 23 Nov 2018 :  08:55:46 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Jeff
Yeah, I know what you mean.
This bearing place is just south of Lille. I might be in France with my car next summer, and may just drop in and see them with an old 240426 bearing, to see if it is the same. - if they keep them in stock, which they may not course.

Andy

1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
2008 LHD "Classic" Renault Twingo
1991 Nissan Figaro
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UK_Sub
Moderator

United Kingdom
2175 Posts

Posted - 23 Nov 2018 :  16:05:00 Show Profile Reply with Quote
I was asking a Swedish gearbox guru about this recently and he suggested the following replacement rear pinion bearing...

1: FAG 3305DA 578845 (with snap ring, but need a distance ring of about 3.3mm)
2: FAG 3305-DA-TVP (without snap ring, can be machined lathing / grinding)
3: Koyo 3305 NR (not split inner ring and need a distance ring of about 3.3mm)

I haven't researched the cost/availability of these though.
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green96v4
V4 Fanatic

Canada
407 Posts

Posted - 24 Nov 2018 :  12:25:28 Show Profile Visit green96v4's Homepage Reply with Quote
FWIW I did this spread sheet a few years ago when going crazy trying to find bearings from the umpteen different sources and comparing all the prices - in short nowhere was consistently cheaper or had the entire suite of bearing available and prices can vary wildly!!



I did purchase a 3305 before the correct 240426 became available on Saabklubben, biggest difference I could see was the bearing cage was nylon on the 3305 and metal on the 240426
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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 25 Nov 2018 :  15:53:08 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Thanks All.
I've been using your spreadsheet as a reference (green96v4). Very useful.

I couldn't resist doing some Black Friday weekend shopping, so have ordered a few bits from Malbrad, simply bearings and ebay. By next weekend I may be ready to get started.

I put the pinion shaft up between centres to check the bearings, about 0.05mm of rock on each outer track, with a load of longitudinal slop (+0.5mm) in the roller bearing (as expected).


Cheers Jeff
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beardydave
V4 Beginner

67 Posts

Posted - 27 Nov 2018 :  22:34:54 Show Profile Reply with Quote
The axial slop on the roller bearing is fine. They can't take an axial load, so they need clearance to prevent damage.

The 0.05 radial play is not so good. Really, this should be checked against manufacturers required clearance between the rollers/balls with feeler gauges once installed with the correct press-fit on the inner and outer races. Not easy (or even possible sometimes) on an auto gearbox.

Someone like SKF could tell you what the clearance would be on a specific bearing type without preload when new for you to compare against, but if it's not a still-live manufacturer or it's so old a bearing there's no record of what it would have been designed to, then there's no hope.

One day i'll have the time to strip and measure a gearbox and calculate the loads and see what modern bearings will be suitable for the NLA bearings. Modern bearings can be much better at load carrying than 60s/70s bearings.

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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 03 Dec 2018 :  19:16:45 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Here's most of the results of my Black Friday shopping spree.
Some of it is "while the engine is out", some is "Just in case".

Gearbox gasket was in a safe place when I took this.
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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 03 Dec 2018 :  19:22:42 Show Profile Reply with Quote
I've been to see my mates at Gravesend transmissions, they replaced the primary shaft roller bearing using their press.
In the second photo you can see the wear on the roller ends of the old bearing.
They used to have a Freewheel rebuild tool made out of an old SU dashpot with a slot cut in. Food for thought.


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Souped Up
V4 Beginner

United Kingdom
72 Posts

Posted - 03 Dec 2018 :  19:30:33 Show Profile Reply with Quote
Because the new double row ball bearing has the snap ring in a different position I needed some spacers.


I harvested some old piston rings from my collection of 2/ car and bike measurement spares. These bikes have 64mm bore size with various ring thicknesses.

Yamaha RD350LC, Durkopp Diana, Suzuki TS185, Lambretta 186cc Imola or Mugello cylinder kits.

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green96v4
V4 Fanatic

Canada
407 Posts

Posted - 04 Dec 2018 :  11:08:18 Show Profile Visit green96v4's Homepage Reply with Quote
following this with interest - great record keeping, thanks for sharing!
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